Je recherche les parents de Louis Hart Hartt Heart Hartz Hens Hert née ver 1799 décédé 07-06-1849 St Anicet époux de Marie Josephte Castagnet Casgagnette Gastagner Gastagnier née 11-02-1809 Bapt. 29-03-1809 à St Régis. Père: Joseph Castagnier Mère : Josephte Dupuis Parain: Antoine Dupuis Marraine : Marguerite Dubeau Ils ont eu 10 enfants et les premiers est Jean Baptiste et Joseph née le 18-11-1831 St Anicet Bapt. 28-01-1832 à St Anicet Je recherche un lien de naissance de Louis avec des Hart Hartt .......Je vous remercie d’avance Chart
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tjacynthe
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Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Chart- Membre actif
- Messages : 9
Date d'inscription : 24/01/2012
Localisation : Valleyfield
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- Message n°1
Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Bonjour
Je recherche les parents de Louis Hart Hartt Heart Hartz Hens Hert née ver 1799 décédé 07-06-1849 St Anicet époux de Marie Josephte Castagnet Casgagnette Gastagner Gastagnier née 11-02-1809 Bapt. 29-03-1809 à St Régis. Père: Joseph Castagnier Mère : Josephte Dupuis Parain: Antoine Dupuis Marraine : Marguerite Dubeau Ils ont eu 10 enfants et les premiers est Jean Baptiste et Joseph née le 18-11-1831 St Anicet Bapt. 28-01-1832 à St Anicet Je recherche un lien de naissance de Louis avec des Hart Hartt .......Je vous remercie d’avance Chart
Je recherche les parents de Louis Hart Hartt Heart Hartz Hens Hert née ver 1799 décédé 07-06-1849 St Anicet époux de Marie Josephte Castagnet Casgagnette Gastagner Gastagnier née 11-02-1809 Bapt. 29-03-1809 à St Régis. Père: Joseph Castagnier Mère : Josephte Dupuis Parain: Antoine Dupuis Marraine : Marguerite Dubeau Ils ont eu 10 enfants et les premiers est Jean Baptiste et Joseph née le 18-11-1831 St Anicet Bapt. 28-01-1832 à St Anicet Je recherche un lien de naissance de Louis avec des Hart Hartt .......Je vous remercie d’avance Chart
tjacynthe- Affirmé
- Messages : 281
Date d'inscription : 04/02/2010
Localisation : Outaouais
- Message n°2
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Bonsoir,
Si je comprends bien l'acte de mariage n'existe pas ou est introuvable ?
Avez-vous les parrains marraines des enfants ? Ou savez-vous si Louis a été parrain pour des enfants Hart ? si vous êtes chanceux on pourrait trouver un "oncle de l'enfant" ?
Bonne fin de soirée
Jacynthe
Si je comprends bien l'acte de mariage n'existe pas ou est introuvable ?
Avez-vous les parrains marraines des enfants ? Ou savez-vous si Louis a été parrain pour des enfants Hart ? si vous êtes chanceux on pourrait trouver un "oncle de l'enfant" ?
Bonne fin de soirée
Jacynthe
Hervé- Administrateur
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- Message n°3
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Il semble que Louis Hart pose beaucoup de problème à tout le monde, si vous lisez l'anglais, lisez cette page
http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/QUEBEC-BEAUHUNTCHAT/2007-05/1178649505
un autre fils de ce couple
http://saumiergenealogy.com/fam00471.htm
et ici, recensement 1851 de tous les Hart
http://www.ogs.on.ca/ogspi/5eh/c5har005.htm#00027
http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/QUEBEC-BEAUHUNTCHAT/2007-05/1178649505
un autre fils de ce couple
http://saumiergenealogy.com/fam00471.htm
et ici, recensement 1851 de tous les Hart
http://www.ogs.on.ca/ogspi/5eh/c5har005.htm#00027
tjacynthe- Affirmé
- Messages : 281
Date d'inscription : 04/02/2010
Localisation : Outaouais
- Message n°4
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Bonjour Hervé,
La bonne famille est là, les Hart de St-Anicet, Beauharnois. Louis, le père est décédé en 1849, Josephte Cascagnette est veuve. Et on a la liste des enfants.
Chez Ancestry, on donne le 14 septembre 1828 à St-Anicet pour le mariage. Curieusement, on retrouve pas le registre pour les années 1828 et 1829, pratique.
Bonne journée à tous, le devoir m'appelle ...
Jacynthe
La bonne famille est là, les Hart de St-Anicet, Beauharnois. Louis, le père est décédé en 1849, Josephte Cascagnette est veuve. Et on a la liste des enfants.
Chez Ancestry, on donne le 14 septembre 1828 à St-Anicet pour le mariage. Curieusement, on retrouve pas le registre pour les années 1828 et 1829, pratique.
Bonne journée à tous, le devoir m'appelle ...
Jacynthe
Chart- Membre actif
- Messages : 9
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Localisation : Valleyfield
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- Message n°5
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Bonjour Hervé
Merci pour tes recherches .
What is known is that he would have been born about 1799. He married
about 1829 and died in 1849 at St. Anicet. His widow remarried in 1853
and on this marriage it states that her borther-in-law Joseph Hart was
present.
Je croyais qu’il étais plutôt le fils de Louis Hart . Joseph Hart est née le 18-11-1831 et Bapt. 28-01-1832 à St Anicet ( 22 ans au 2e mariage de Josephte ) et à épousée Florence Dupuis le 10-01-1853 à St Anicet qui est mon ar.ar. Ar. Grande père.
Au plaisir Chart:arrow:
Merci pour tes recherches .
What is known is that he would have been born about 1799. He married
about 1829 and died in 1849 at St. Anicet. His widow remarried in 1853
and on this marriage it states that her borther-in-law Joseph Hart was
present.
Je croyais qu’il étais plutôt le fils de Louis Hart . Joseph Hart est née le 18-11-1831 et Bapt. 28-01-1832 à St Anicet ( 22 ans au 2e mariage de Josephte ) et à épousée Florence Dupuis le 10-01-1853 à St Anicet qui est mon ar.ar. Ar. Grande père.
Au plaisir Chart:arrow:
lucillep- Membre actif
- Messages : 34
Date d'inscription : 14/12/2011
Age : 71
Localisation : Lac St-Jean
Emploi/loisirs : retraitée
- Message n°6
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Étrange mais il me semble avoir donné une réponse hier
avec un lien
avec un lien
lucillep- Membre actif
- Messages : 34
Date d'inscription : 14/12/2011
Age : 71
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- Message n°7
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
L'histoire semble être que le père de Louis était un homme très connu et il a eu beaucoup d'enfants de plusieurs femmes. Alors son père serait Moses HArt et la mère Sarah Judah
Hart was a difficult man to do business with. The same held true in personal and family matters. In 1799 he married his cousin Sarah after a stormy courtship punctuated by squabbles with her father, Uriah Judah. Three children, Areli Blake, Orobio, and Louisa Howard, were born of their rather fragile union. In 1807 Sarah went back to her parents’ home and obtained a monthly pension of £4 3s. 0d. After getting Hart to agree to drive out his “two women,” she returned to him and remained for about five years. But in 1814 she again denounced his conduct and dissolute life, and in the end obtained on 15 March 1816 an annual pension of £300.
Hart was a difficult man to do business with. The same held true in personal and family matters. In 1799 he married his cousin Sarah after a stormy courtship punctuated by squabbles with her father, Uriah Judah. Three children, Areli Blake, Orobio, and Louisa Howard, were born of their rather fragile union. In 1807 Sarah went back to her parents’ home and obtained a monthly pension of £4 3s. 0d. After getting Hart to agree to drive out his “two women,” she returned to him and remained for about five years. But in 1814 she again denounced his conduct and dissolute life, and in the end obtained on 15 March 1816 an annual pension of £300.
lucillep- Membre actif
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Date d'inscription : 14/12/2011
Age : 71
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- Message n°8
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Hart had an astonishing number of fairly short affairs. He would finish his days with Mary McCarthy (the widow of one Peter Brown), who, along with some of his legitimate and illegitimate children, was to inherit part of his assets. Hart already had at various times acknowledged and even lent assistance to a number of his other illegitimate children.
Profoundly affected by his matrimonial rebuffs and influenced by his reading of foreign philosophers, Hart began writing discourses – as yet unpublished – in which he attacked the Catholic faith, and then finally proposed a new religion. In 1815 he had a 60-page pamphlet entitled General universal religion printed in New York; he took up his treatise again in 1824 under the title Modern religion. He made use of his business connections to circulate his texts and his ideas, and on occasion made himself available to give lectures to promote his religion which, he said, was relevant to both Jews and deists. He also kept up a correspondence with American deists, among them William Carver.
From 1825 or 1826 Hart seems to have recovered a degree of equanimity in his personal life. No doubt having Mary McCarthy by his side was a factor. From then on he concentrated on his numerous concerns and took a greater interest in political questions than in religious ones.
Profoundly affected by his matrimonial rebuffs and influenced by his reading of foreign philosophers, Hart began writing discourses – as yet unpublished – in which he attacked the Catholic faith, and then finally proposed a new religion. In 1815 he had a 60-page pamphlet entitled General universal religion printed in New York; he took up his treatise again in 1824 under the title Modern religion. He made use of his business connections to circulate his texts and his ideas, and on occasion made himself available to give lectures to promote his religion which, he said, was relevant to both Jews and deists. He also kept up a correspondence with American deists, among them William Carver.
From 1825 or 1826 Hart seems to have recovered a degree of equanimity in his personal life. No doubt having Mary McCarthy by his side was a factor. From then on he concentrated on his numerous concerns and took a greater interest in political questions than in religious ones.
lucillep- Membre actif
- Messages : 34
Date d'inscription : 14/12/2011
Age : 71
Localisation : Lac St-Jean
Emploi/loisirs : retraitée
- Message n°9
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Mariage:
Avant le 10 janvier 1838
en un Lieu indéterminé
TROUVER CE MARIAGE DANS UNE AUTRE RÉGION
TROUVER CE MARIAGE DANS UNE AUTRE RÉGION
Louis Hart
et
Josephte Castagnet
Mariage des enfants dans cette région:
voici une liste sommaire des enfants de Louis
Avant le 10 janvier 1838
en un Lieu indéterminé
TROUVER CE MARIAGE DANS UNE AUTRE RÉGION
TROUVER CE MARIAGE DANS UNE AUTRE RÉGION
Louis Hart
et
Josephte Castagnet
Mariage des enfants dans cette région:
1853-01-10 | Saint-Anicet | Joseph | M | Florence Dupuis |
1856-04-21 | Saint-Anicet | Josephte | F | Charles Carty |
1858-07-27 | Saint-Anicet | Jean-Baptiste | M | Odile-Sarah Bonneville |
1870-12-23 | Saint-Anicet | Pierre | M | Julie Holden |
voici une liste sommaire des enfants de Louis
lucillep- Membre actif
- Messages : 34
Date d'inscription : 14/12/2011
Age : 71
Localisation : Lac St-Jean
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- Message n°10
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Ici nous avons un enfant marié
Mariage:
Avant le 25 octobre 1835
en un Lieu indéterminé
Moses Hart
et
Sarah Judah
Mariage des enfants dans cette région:
Mariage:
Avant le 25 octobre 1835
en un Lieu indéterminé
Moses Hart
et
Sarah Judah
Mariage des enfants dans cette région:
1847-10-25 | Trois-Rivieres | Charlotte-Mathilda | F | J.-Ludger Desilets |
lucillep- Membre actif
- Messages : 34
Date d'inscription : 14/12/2011
Age : 71
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- Message n°11
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Il est très difficile de trouver des actes en 1828 puisque les registres sont manquants pendant 4 ans à Ste-Anicet peux être que ce fut fait directement à Beauharnois.
Chart- Membre actif
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Localisation : Valleyfield
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- Message n°12
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Merci à vous pour vos recommendations je vais diriger mes recherches sur les parrains de ses enfants .
Au plaisir et bonne soirée Chart
Au plaisir et bonne soirée Chart
Rcantin- Habitué
- Messages : 137
Date d'inscription : 24/10/2011
- Message n°13
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Moses Hart et Sarah Judah se sont epouses le 10 avril 1799 a Trois-Rivieres.
D'apres le genealogie faite par la Congregration Juive de Ontreal, Moses n'a pas de fils Louis..
J'ai le document mais ne sais pas comment l'attaché ici..
Il y a beaucoup de Hart dans la region de la Gaspesie differente branche des Hart de Trois-Rivieres.
D'apres le genealogie faite par la Congregration Juive de Ontreal, Moses n'a pas de fils Louis..
J'ai le document mais ne sais pas comment l'attaché ici..
Il y a beaucoup de Hart dans la region de la Gaspesie differente branche des Hart de Trois-Rivieres.
Rcantin- Habitué
- Messages : 137
Date d'inscription : 24/10/2011
- Message n°14
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
In 1799 he married his cousin Sarah after a stormy courtship punctuated by squabbles with her father, Uriah Judah. Three children, Areli Blake, Orobio, and Louisa Howard, were born of their rather fragile union. In 1807 Sarah went back to her parents' home and obtained a monthly pension of £4 3s. 0d. After getting Hart to agree to drive out his "two women," she returned to him and remained for about five years. But in 1814 she again denounced his conduct and dissolute life, and in the end obtained on March 15, 1816 an annual pension of £300.
aussi:
http://www.biographi.ca/009004-119.01-f.php?&id_nbr=3959&&PHPSESSID=ychzfqkvzape
aussi:
http://www.biographi.ca/009004-119.01-f.php?&id_nbr=3959&&PHPSESSID=ychzfqkvzape
lucillep- Membre actif
- Messages : 34
Date d'inscription : 14/12/2011
Age : 71
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- Message n°15
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
En effet il n'a pas vraiment un fils Louis mais comme j'ai écrit plus haut il a des illégitimes un peu partout et il semble que Louis soit le fils illégitime de Moses.
Moses et son épouse se sont mariés ensuite séparés ensuite ils sont revenus ensemble et on conçus d'autres enfants.
Moses et son épouse se sont mariés ensuite séparés ensuite ils sont revenus ensemble et on conçus d'autres enfants.
Rcantin- Habitué
- Messages : 137
Date d'inscription : 24/10/2011
- Message n°16
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Selon le congres Juif de MOntreal voici les enfants de Moses.
Elon
Dobrio
Louisa
Aurelie Blake
alexander-Thomas, ne en 1804
Reuben.
a moins qu'Elon et Reuben portent egalement le nom de louis..
remarquez plus haut on en nomme que 3 enfants officiellement, :
Three children, Areli Blake, Orobio, and Louisa Howard,
Elon
Dobrio
Louisa
Aurelie Blake
alexander-Thomas, ne en 1804
Reuben.
a moins qu'Elon et Reuben portent egalement le nom de louis..
remarquez plus haut on en nomme que 3 enfants officiellement, :
Three children, Areli Blake, Orobio, and Louisa Howard,
Rcantin- Habitué
- Messages : 137
Date d'inscription : 24/10/2011
- Message n°17
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Denis Vaugeois vient de publier un livre sur les HART de Trois-rivieres.
Chart- Membre actif
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- Message n°18
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Merci pour vos renseignements je vais me concentré sur les parrains et les épouses de Moses que j’ai trouvé dans le volume Les Premiers juifs d’Amérique 1760-1860 par Denis Vaugeois . Un ouvrage très intéressent sur la famille Hart . D’après DenisVaugeois les épouses son Sarah Judah, Mary Cline Mary Rarine,Marie Godin, Margaret Burn, Margaret Armstong, Anne Galarno, Catherine Holyward, Mme Davison, Mary McCarty et trois autres inconnues.
Bonne soirée Chart
Bonne soirée Chart
Rcantin- Habitué
- Messages : 137
Date d'inscription : 24/10/2011
- Message n°19
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Il y a beaucoup de Heart a St-Anicet:
etes-vous certain du patronyme?????
ID: I1038
Name: Jean Baptiste HEART
Surname: HEART
Given Name: Jean Baptiste
Sex: M
Birth: ABT 1838
_UID: FFBF85B453C4D6118898BA93FD3986304E4E
Change Date: 25 Jan 2000 at 00:00:00
Father: Louis HEART
Mother: Josephte CASCAGNETTE
Marriage 1 Sara Odile BONNEVILLE b: ABT 1840 in St Anicet, Huntingdon, Que
etes-vous certain du patronyme?????
Father: Louis HEART
Mother: Josephte CASCAGNETTE
Marriage 1 Sara Odile BONNEVILLE b: ABT 1840 in St Anicet, Huntingdon, Que
- Married: 27 Jul 1858 in St Anicet, Huntingdon, Que
- Marie Odile Louise HEART b: 15 Apr 1860 in St Anicet, Huntingdon, Que
- Justine Elizabeth HEART b: 29 Oct 1861 in St Anicet, Huntingdon, Que
Rcantin- Habitué
- Messages : 137
Date d'inscription : 24/10/2011
- Message n°20
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
une fille de Louis:
josephine:
josephine:
Charles Carty |
Josephie Heart |
1856 |
Mariage (Marriage) |
Catholique |
St-Anicet |
Québec (Quebec) |
Rcantin- Habitué
- Messages : 137
Date d'inscription : 24/10/2011
- Message n°21
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
un fils de Louis:
Joseph Heart |
Florence Dupuis |
1853 |
Mariage (Marriage) |
Catholique |
St-Anicet |
Québec (Quebec) |
Rcantin- Habitué
- Messages : 137
Date d'inscription : 24/10/2011
- Message n°22
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
une fille Adeline, le nom de la mere est cependant Louise Cascagnet.
la famille semble originiare de Truut-Rivers ou Frot convington,N.Y.
la famille semble originiare de Truut-Rivers ou Frot convington,N.Y.
Joseph Lemay [Jos Lemay] |
Ad Heart |
1858 |
Mariage (Marriage) |
Catholique |
St-Anicet |
Québec (Quebec |
Chart- Membre actif
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Localisation : Valleyfield
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- Message n°23
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Merci Rcantin de l’intérêts sur la famille Hart. J’ai en général toutes les fiches de B.M.S. des descendants de Louis Hart .
Bonne Journée Chart
Bonne Journée Chart
rmarion- Membre
- Messages : 1
Date d'inscription : 08/01/2013
- Message n°24
Louis Hart
Hello Mr. Hart,
I am Rick Marion 3x great-grandson of Louis through Jean-Baptiste and Odile Sarah Bonneville.
I have been searching this line for many years and have some theories about Louis's parents.
Having been in touch with other Hart researchers over the last 15 years, I learned that it was thought that Louis was the son of Moses Hart of Trois Rivieres and it may well have been true that louis believed he was the illegitimate (one of many by Moses). It also appears that Moses may have believed he was the father of Louis as well as after his death it does appear that a lawyer from Fort Covington, NY was in touch with the Hart's of St. Anicet about their possible inheritance.
In fact, I can recall when I first started looking into the Harts around 1980 that one of my uncles mentioned that he remembered hearing that there was some Jewish in the family...which I brushed off at the time as unlikely as we were all Catholic.
Anyway, after much research I found that Louis' marriage which would have occurred around 1828 was missing from the St. Anicet registers. I believe this was related to his mistress at the time of Moses death wanting to reduce the number of claims against his estate. I think these pages were removed for this purpose.
I have also discovered a baptism at Trois Rivieres of a child named Louis Ezechiel, without parents names Sept. 14, 1804. This would fit well with a child of Moses as he had a brother named Ezechiel.
One route that has been taken to prove/disprove this connection, was through the use of DNA. Since men inherit the Y-dna sequence of their father, if Louis was the son of Moses his Y-dna should match any legitimate son of Moses or any of his brothers. This was eventually done through one of the Hart's of St. Anicet having his dna analyzed as well as a Mr. Hart in trois Rivieres who is descended from Benjamin, one of Moses brothers. Unfortunately, the Y-dna of the two of them did not match, which, on the face of it would imply that Louis was not Moses son (genetically anyway). This still needs some further dna testing to be sure as there may have been illegitimate children (known or unknown) within either of the two Hart lines that were used for the dna test. To be sure, at least 1 more from each family needs to be tested to see if they still match those already done.
It could have been that Moses mistress wasn't just Moses mistress but had other men also. It would have been to her advantage to have Moses accept her child as his son.
The search goes on, still looking for more Harts to do the dna test as well as any documentation that Moses at least thought Louis was his son.
Regards,
Rick Marion
I am Rick Marion 3x great-grandson of Louis through Jean-Baptiste and Odile Sarah Bonneville.
I have been searching this line for many years and have some theories about Louis's parents.
Having been in touch with other Hart researchers over the last 15 years, I learned that it was thought that Louis was the son of Moses Hart of Trois Rivieres and it may well have been true that louis believed he was the illegitimate (one of many by Moses). It also appears that Moses may have believed he was the father of Louis as well as after his death it does appear that a lawyer from Fort Covington, NY was in touch with the Hart's of St. Anicet about their possible inheritance.
In fact, I can recall when I first started looking into the Harts around 1980 that one of my uncles mentioned that he remembered hearing that there was some Jewish in the family...which I brushed off at the time as unlikely as we were all Catholic.
Anyway, after much research I found that Louis' marriage which would have occurred around 1828 was missing from the St. Anicet registers. I believe this was related to his mistress at the time of Moses death wanting to reduce the number of claims against his estate. I think these pages were removed for this purpose.
I have also discovered a baptism at Trois Rivieres of a child named Louis Ezechiel, without parents names Sept. 14, 1804. This would fit well with a child of Moses as he had a brother named Ezechiel.
One route that has been taken to prove/disprove this connection, was through the use of DNA. Since men inherit the Y-dna sequence of their father, if Louis was the son of Moses his Y-dna should match any legitimate son of Moses or any of his brothers. This was eventually done through one of the Hart's of St. Anicet having his dna analyzed as well as a Mr. Hart in trois Rivieres who is descended from Benjamin, one of Moses brothers. Unfortunately, the Y-dna of the two of them did not match, which, on the face of it would imply that Louis was not Moses son (genetically anyway). This still needs some further dna testing to be sure as there may have been illegitimate children (known or unknown) within either of the two Hart lines that were used for the dna test. To be sure, at least 1 more from each family needs to be tested to see if they still match those already done.
It could have been that Moses mistress wasn't just Moses mistress but had other men also. It would have been to her advantage to have Moses accept her child as his son.
The search goes on, still looking for more Harts to do the dna test as well as any documentation that Moses at least thought Louis was his son.
Regards,
Rick Marion
Hervé- Administrateur
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- Message n°25
Re: Recherche parent de Louis Hart
Thank you Rick for all these details, I am sure this will help other researchers. I do not know if somebody here need a translation, I will do it if needed. Thank you again for your input.
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